Hello, and welcome to another episode of the Working Conversations podcast, where we talk all things leadership, business, communication, and trends in organizational life. I'm your host, Dr. Janel Anderson.

Picture this. It's 10am on a Tuesday and you're sitting at your kitchen table, your laptop is open and you're deep in work mode. But out of the corner of your eye, you notice a basket of laundry that needs folding. Before you know it, you're mid task switching between spreadsheets and socks. Sound familiar? Well, if you're working from home or juggling a hybrid schedule, you've probably felt the blurring of boundaries between your work life and your home life.

Today, we're diving into why those boundaries matter, what happens when they're crossed, and how you can set clear lines to protect your time, energy and well being in this hybrid world. Now, if you've followed my work for any length of time, you'll know that the laundry does not tempt me when I'm working. But I know it does for many. Now, for me personally, it's more likely to be a teenager who forgot their iPad at home and wants me to run it over to school, or one of those same teens who wants a ride to go do something with friends after school or in the summer. And my workday isn't over yet. That's where I personally really grapple with boundaries. Now, in today's episode, we're diving into those boundaries. What they are, why they matter, and how to navigate them in a world where work and home often overlap.

Now, for those of you who do have teens and tweens and kids who are home during the summer, you're going to want to bookmark this episode because when summer vacation rolls around, you're going to want to re listen to this to get firm on those boundaries so that it's not the laundry calling because it will be the kids calling instead. So you need to get clear on those boundaries and you might need a refresher on episode around that time.

So first of all, what are boundaries? Well, boundaries are the invisible rules that we set for ourselves and others about what's acceptable and what's not acceptable. In fact, a lot of times we don't even think consciously about our boundaries. We just know when they've been broken because we either feel like we've let ourselves down or we've let somebody else down or we feel some sense of guilt about something. So, Brene Brown, whom you're probably familiar with her work in her book Dare to Lead from a few years back, 2018 is when that book came out. She describes boundaries as simply what's okay and what's not okay. And she emphasizes the importance of boundaries in maintaining healthy relationships and really self respect.

Because when you are caving on your boundaries on a regular basis, it is yourself whom you are letting down. So really important to remember that boundaries are really mostly for you. They're not so much for other people. In fact, it's going to mean saying no to other people in order to keep your boundaries in place. Now, research in the Journal of Positive Psychology from a few years back highlights the importance of boundaries for overall well being, showing that individuals with clear personal boundaries report higher levels of satisfaction, lower stress, and get this one, better work life balance. Exactly. All right, so that's what boundaries are.

Again, a lot of times we haven't even articulated these boundaries to ourselves. We just know that we're disappointed in ourselves because we let our work slide while we like for me, run, you know, run the iPad over to the, over to the school when a kid forgets it or this summer a lot. This past summer a lot. I was taking my youngest son fishing. So he's, he's just about 14. And so over the summer he was 13 and he was going fishing with his friends all the time. But the lake that they would fish at, and there were a few different lakes to choose from, were just not like something close enough to walk to or bike to. And so there were lots of rides to the lake to go fishing. And man, those boundaries, when I broke my own rules and drove him to the lake, it was just like, oh, why am I doing this? And it really did a number on not only my work life balance, because then there was always work that was left over that needed to be done in the evening or the weekend if I was taking, you know, half an hour out of the day to run him over to the lake and back.

So when boundaries get crossed, and I can use my own example here, those boundary violations lead to frustration, resentment, and even potentially burnout with your work. So first of all, we have to address what the boundaries are. We have to articulate them. We have to figure them out. So a good way to, if you haven't done boundary work before, a good way to start to do that is to when you notice the rule being broken. And again, it's like going back to Brene Brown's thinking framing of it, it's what, okay, what's okay and what's not okay? And you're feeling like maybe, oh God, that wasn't okay, that I stopped work in the middle of the day and drove my kid to the lake to go fishing, that wasn't okay. Why did I do that? Okay, that is a clear indication that there was a boundary and that you crossed it. So that would be a good one to just like jot that down so you don't forget it and that the next time it comes up you can actually make a different choice.

We'll talk about that. I'm getting ahead of myself a little bit. We'll talk about that more here in just a minute. Now again, when boundaries are crossed, it leads to that sense of frustration, resentment, burnout. But we have to know what the boundary is before we will even be able to address it. Now when you do have that boundary violation, like for example, me stopping what I'm doing and driving my son to go fishing, and then I feel guilt and frustration and anger and resentment and all the things, a lot of it self directed, a little bit of it might be towards him, but I'm the one who said yes. And so I'm directing a lot of that at myself. So the first thing to do is to pause and reflect.

Why does this feel wrong? What specific behavior or action crossed the line? Was it him asking no? Because you know what kids are going to ask. They're going to ask and ask and ask. It was me saying yes when I wanted to say no. Okay, so you have to pause and reflect. You have to dial that in and figure that out. And then you have to communicate clearly about what's okay and what's not okay.

So in a situation like this, I would say something like, I can't leave in the middle of a workday to take you fishing. I could take you fishing at 4:30. I'll try to wrap things up early and be done at 430. I could take you fishing then. So being clear about what's okay, what's not okay, what's that rule, what's the line and who crosses it, heads up, it's probably you crossing it, not the other person. Now sometimes other people cross your boundaries and that's part of boundaries as well. But a lot of times it's us crossing our own boundaries. Once you are able to clearly communicate what you want to have happen instead of just to simply cave and say yes. And people pleasers, I'm especially talking to you because it's really easy for you to say yes to other things when you would prefer to say no to them because you're doing the people pleasing part of it. So then you have to reinforce the boundary.

So that's the third part of it. First is you have to recognize the boundary, communicate clearly what you want to have happen, and then reinforce that boundary. So politely but firmly restate your limit. Because in a case like this, I'm going to have the teenage kid who cannot drive yet wanting to go fishing, asking and re asking, well, when can you take me? Can dad take me? And asking and asking. So then, in fact, this one came up a lot in the future. And here's how I handled it. To reinforce that boundary, I said in the future, if you could plan your fishing expeditions in advance and then book the ride with me in advance, then I will be able to take that 30 minutes out of my workday because we've planned for it, and then take you fishing. So reinforcing the boundary for me, it's not like, no, I can't take you, but I can take you when it's planned, when it's impromptu, then my answer is going to be no, because I'm busy with my work.

Unless there's like the occasion where I've finished everything up early. But most often that was not the case with me. Now let's look specific. So now that you have a sense of what boundaries are, how they get crossed, how you articulate what you want to do, where that boundary line is and what you're going to do instead. Now let's dive into boundaries in the hybrid world of work. Because still so many people are working from home some of the time or all of the time. And this shift in remote and hybrid work has created new boundary challenges. A 2022 Gallup report found that remote workers often experience longer work days and more difficulty disconnecting at the end of the workday compared with their office based counterparts.

So like when you get up and leave the office and drive home or commute home or bicycle or walk home, or however you get from the office to home, it is really easy to switch off of work mode and on to personal mode. So instead as we're working from home, it creates this always on culture. And Microsoft Work Trends index from 2023 revealed a 252% increase in after hours teams messages since 2020. 252% more after hours teams messages flying back and forth. So that is, you know, just part and parcel of this world that we're in. If you don't have firm boundaries around answering messages after hours, then you're going to find yourself part of that 252% increase. In being online and answering those messages.

So let me share another personal experience for me in addition to the fishing, because that was real and that was my real life all summer long. But we actually made some progress with that. We got that boundary in place. You want me to give you the ride? We need to book it in advance. It needs to be like at least 24 hours in advance, but ideally a good couple days in advance. I mean, sometimes I was like giving a speech or I just wasn't even going to be home. So we could negotiate then. Well, that day doesn't work for me, but the day before works great or the day after works great.

But let me give you a different experience and this is one that's more current right now. I recently rented an office space outside of my home. And it is, I tell you what, the best thing that I have done in such a long time. Such a good decision. And for me, it was about creating that physical boundary that mentally signaled, this is my work time and this is where I'm creative in my work endeavors and this is my home. Now, I don't think I had fully realized how blurred those boundaries had gotten.

Now it's really super easy. If I'm working from home and a kid forgets their laptop or their iPad rather, it's easy for me to or for them to reach out to me and go, mom, can you bring this to school? Because our home isn't that far from the school. Now, my office is a little bit further from home and school than my office is a little bit further from school than my home is. So I'm like three miles on the other side of both of the schools. I have a youngest in middle school still and the middle child is in high school. And so my office is three miles east of the house, and so I'm further away. And I'm not the first call when somebody forgets their laptop.

My husband works from home a lot and he's probably going to be the first call when something gets forgotten. Now, for me, this office represents boundaries. Absolutely. But it also represents creativity and innovation and a space where I can be, you know, the full freedom of self expression of my work. Now, if you'll notice, for those of you who are watching on YouTube, you see the shelving system behind me. This was intentional. This was intentionally designed to be in this space.

I have a studio in this space where I can record the podcast and teach classes to my clients who have me for online classes or the occasional virtual. So I have this amazing studio space. And then on the other side of that wall, there's a big office with a little sitting area and a great big desk and a work table. So I have just this amazing workspace that calls to me every morning when I get up. I don't want it. I still have my home office, but I don't want to work there very often. There's a big snowstorm or if later this week I will be working there because I'm catching a flight at the end of the day and and so I will still have a few items to be throwing into my suitcase and so on. And I'm teaching some online classes, so it's just going to be convenient for me to be working from home that day.

So I still have that opportunity. But I have this very, very distinct boundary now. Now, again, I don't think I fully appreciated how much the boundary between my home life and my work life had gotten blurry. And it would be not even surprising for me to find myself, let's say right now as I'm recording this, it's my Christmas decorations haven't been put away. This episode doesn't go live for a couple weeks, but I might hopefully by then my Christmas decorations will be put away. But it would be really easy if I was working from home to go up to the kitchen, have some lunch, notice those Christmas stockings still hanging by the chimney with care, and start putting them away. And before I would know it, like a whole hour was gone by and maybe I didn't even eat my lunch. So I definitely feel a much more preserved sense of distinct boundaries having this office.

And I just love it so much. I just love it so much. All right, maybe we'll do on social media, we'll do a tour of the office. So, yeah, watch for, watch for an Instagram reel or if you follow me on my Dr. Janel Anderson on Facebook, watch there for a reel of the office. We'll do a quick office tour. Okay, so back to this whole idea, though, about boundaries. A study by in the journal Environment and Behavior by Morrow and Getz, and this goes all the way back to 1988, supports the idea that physical separation between work and personal space reduces role conflict and increases productivity.

Now, I know some people are going to push back on that and say, but then I have to commute. And so I'm going to say individual results may vary. For me personally, I am so productive at this office. I just like kick butt and take names. It is not even, it is not even funny. The difference between my productivity here versus my home office. All right, so let's get now down to the practical. How do you create those boundaries and how do you enforce them?

Now, boundaries are deeply personal. There is no one size fits all approach. Just because I have this boundary of not wanting to stop my work and take a kid fishing or run a forgotten item over to the school or whatever, that doesn't necessarily mean that that's your boundary. That's my boundary. So here are a handful of tips for identifying and then setting boundaries. So first, think about what's most important to you. Your family, your work life balance, personal time, your freedom of self expression in your work, getting work done by a certain time of day so that you can shut it down for the day. That would be a reason that I wouldn't want to run something over to the school because that's going to interrupt my school. That's going to interrupt my workday and make work longer hours.

And in fact, that's what was happening when I was taking kids fishing. But your boundaries should really reflect those priorities. Now, family is a top priority for me. It is one of my top values. And I also recognize that when I don't run something over to the school, I'm teaching the kids to remember to bring all the things they need with them because it might hurt a little bit to be without the iPad for the school day. And some days I just literally can't get it there because I'm not home or I'm, you know, I'm traveling out of town or I'm over here at the office in the studio recording podcasts. All right, so there are some studies in occupational health psychology, such as those by dirks from 2015, that show that when individuals set clear boundaries aligned with their values, they report lower levels of exhaustion and greater psychological detachment from work. That means it's easier to let go.

And that was published in 2015 in the journal of Occupational Health and Health Psychology. So it is really, really helpful for our mental health to say, this is when I'm working and this is when I'm not working. Now you then need to anticipate the, the points at which you might be, you know, the button pushing, where you might be pressed to break your own boundary or cross your own boundary. So what situations or behaviors often lead to the boundary violations? And then you want to set clear expectations. So communicate with your family, with your co workers, with whomever it is, even with yourself, about what you will and won't do. Now let's put some other examples. Maybe not my examples to this. So let's say work from home boundaries decide when your workday begins and when it ends.

Also, with your workspace, set up that dedicated area for work, even if it's just a specific chair or table or corner of the room, so that you know that when you're in that area, you're focused on work. And the laundry can wait or the dishes or whatever might be vying for your attention, that can wait. Because for right now, I'm at work, I'm in this corner, I'm in the office, in the basement, I'm in whatever that space is. Another thing that can really help with boundaries is turning off the notifications of personal things during your work time and vice versa, turning off your work notifications during your personal time. And some of you are just getting hives by me saying that, yes, turn off your notifications on your work, email, your phone, all the things so that your personal time truly is your personal time. So research from Pew notes that, and this came out in 2022, 59% of Americans who work from home at least part of the time say that they struggle to off those notifications after hours. That struggle is real, my friends, but it is a boundary. So consistency is key.

If you don't honor your own boundaries, others won't honor them either. Now use polite but firm language to enforce your boundaries. So maybe you're saying to your boss or your co workers or your clients, I'm not available for calls after 6pm but I'll respond first thing tomorrow. Maybe it's you're trying to keep your workday in your workday. So you might say to your family, hey, during work hours, I need quiet time to focus and I need to stay in this physical space and do my work. So I can't drive you somewhere or, you know, whatever it is you need me to do, but I'm happy to help after 5pm or after 6pm or whatever time your workday ends. So just be prepared to hold yourself accountable as well and resist the urge. I'm going back to email to like check just one more time or I'll just check quickly before bed. But then when you see those six emails, then there most people are going to say, well, I'll just quickly answer them so that they're not waiting for me in the morning. And then you've gone ahead and broken your own boundary.

So let's give you some action steps for setting boundaries. First of all, take like 10 minutes to jot down some ideas about where your boundaries currently feel solid and where they might be lacking. So again, those areas where you feel personal guilt or that you've let yourself down because you did something for someone else, okay? And then communicate one new boundary this week. So choose a boundary that feels important and discuss it with the relevant people. Or don't discuss it, just discuss it with yourself. You don't have to tell anyone.

You just need to say no when the opportunity to cross that boundary presents itself. And most of the time when you say no, you don't even have to give a reason. You can just say, no, I can't. No, not now. And then you might offer when you could, when you could help, or when you might be available to do that, but you don't need to explain yourself now. As long as you like your reason, you're good. Now, if your boss asks why you're saying no, well, then I'm going to say give an answer. Okay? So you can give a reason.

Hey, I need to be present with my family in the evening, so I won't be looking at email after 6pm if there's an emergency and you do need to reach me, please call me on my mobile phone or my landline if you have one of those. Okay? And then establish a boundary ritual. So create some symbolic way to transition between work and home for those of you who are doing some remote work or remote work all the time. So here are some examples. Maybe you change clothes when work is done. So you've dressed maybe at least semi professionally from the waist up because you're on teams calls a lot during the day or zoom calls. And then when work is over, you change into your sloppy sweatshirt or your cozy flannel shirt or whatever it is that you would wear on the weekend.

So change out of your work attire into your weekend attire or your after work attire. Another thing that you can do, and I recommended this so much during the height of the pandemic, is to do something that symbolizes your commute. So take a short walk before and after your workday and that symbolizes I am now stepping away from my personal life and going to take this walk. It's kind of like my commute. And then I come back into my workspace and now I'm on in work mode. And then likewise do the reverse at the end of the day, step out of your workspace, take a short walk, maybe just quickly around the block, and then come back and now be present at home in your Personal life, another thing sounds so simple, but just physically powering down your laptop or some other symbolic way of shutting down your workspace. Studies on ritualized behavior like these all the way back in 2015, again, pre pandemic in the Journal of Experimental Psychology, show that these actions reduce stress when they signal that transition between your work time and your personal time. Your brain loves those transitions because your brain goes like, oh, okay, now we can focus on our personal life so we can read a book or watch some TV or cook some food or play with the dog.

So your brain loves those distinct transitions. All right? And. And then I want to recommend that you evaluate and adjust. So boundaries are not static. They may need to evolve as your circumstances change or as your family changes or as your work role changes. So set a reminder to reassess your boundaries every few months or when you just sense that something isn't working that well with one of your boundaries. All right, my friends, those. Those are the things, all the things about boundaries.

So boundaries aren't just rules. They are an act of self respect and a way to honor your own needs and to put your own needs first. So, my dear listeners, I want to encourage you to take some small, manageable steps this week to create clarity between your work life and your personal life or wherever you need the boundaries. I know a lot of people just need to turn work off. Even if you're working in the office, a lot of people are still glued to that work cell phone or they have a work email on their personal cell phone. So just shut them. Shut those things down. The work can wait.

And if they really need to reach you, they will find you. They will call you. All right, so my closing question for you is, what is one boundary that you can set today that will improve your work life or your home life, or perhaps both? Okay? Do the work. Figure it out. Your life will be better as a result.

So thank you again so much for joining me on this episode of Working Conversations. If this topic resonated with you, or if you have a friend who might like this episode, by all means, please, please share the episode with them. As always, stay curious, stay informed, and stay ahead of the curve.

Tune in next week when we are approaching the 200th episode of the Working Conversations Pasa podcast. I've got something very special in store for you next week for that 200th episode. And until then, my friends, be well. And if you learned something or you simply enjoy the content here, please subscribe to my channel on YouTube.

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Again, we've got some fun stuff in store for you next week. All right? Until next time, keep thriving and keep working toward your ideal